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Post by play88 on Nov 6, 2010 7:45:40 GMT -5
like you said MVP should be the player on a WINNING team and takes them deep in the playoffs.
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Post by Hello on Nov 6, 2010 14:44:18 GMT -5
And for the how many playoff appearances and championships question. It's not any surprise to anyone on here that Crestviews program over the past several years has been extremely good and if not the best in the league a close second to South Range. They have had some great teams but it doesnt necessarily mean they have had the best player. The best group of 40 or 50 players? Yes. and dont get me wrong, im not saying Dan Skiba is head and shoulders above Carter Hill. I think both are extremely gifted and talented players. But if I had to pick one based on their performance THIS season, its Skiba. Sorry, but if Skiba was an MVP, they would not have went 6-4. You take Hill away from C-view and the they would go 6-4. Hill is a proven winner and Skiba has not proven ANYTHING. Oh and if you but skiba on our team, he may be lucky to be second best on our team this year. He would be 3rd best in 2008, as BOTH Hill's were better than him. Sorry, but MVP's don't let their team finish with a pathetic 6-4 record and no playoffs. That's just the way it is. You are missing my point. Carter Hill plays for Crestview. Dan Skiba plays for Mineral Ridge. Crestviews TEAM is better than Mineral Ridges TEAM. Dan Skiba touched the ball 144 times this season. How many did Carter Hill? exactly, Carter Hill had more carries than Skiba and 600 less yards. Not to mention his 153 pass attempts. Put the ball in Skibas hands that many times and see what kind of numbers he puts up. Take Skiba off that Ridge team and they go 2-8. Carter Hill had better players around him and he is not the lone reason for Crestviews success. A big part, but not the lone reason. And as for Ridges losses. A loss to Campbell in the first week in a shootout where Skiba touched the ball 14 times and put up big numbers. Labrae week 2 loss by a score, once again limited touches for Skiba. Why? nobody knows. Even when the Rams started winning his touches were limited as he avg. 14 carries a game. 1600 yards and 27 touchdowns on 14 carries a game? That is rediculous. The best player doesn't always play for the best team as football is a team sport. Ben Roethlisberger led the Steelers to a Super Bowl, yes he is a geat player and played very well, but to say he was better than Peyton Manning or Tom Brady just isn't true. Yes I think Carter Hill is deserving of the MVP and I wouldn't be the least bit shocked if he got it, but your reasoning for why he deserves it is wrong. Like I said, put Dan Skiba on Crestview, give hime 200 carries, and say hello to a 2500, 35 td year. |
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Post by set it off on Nov 6, 2010 23:06:45 GMT -5
Skiba is a better player.
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Post by ramfan01 on Nov 6, 2010 23:09:22 GMT -5
like you said MVP should be the player on a WINNING team and takes them deep in the playoffs. So is losing in the first round considerd a deep run? lol |
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Post by yep on Nov 7, 2010 6:10:06 GMT -5
At least he was there! Where was mR. Skiba during week 11? THhat's right. At home. Because he couldn't get it done on the field. Just like last year. And the year before. And the year before. And the year before.So when was the last time MR has done ANYTHING?? just face it. Your program and your team is a failure and a joke. Every year we hear that THIS will be MR year. And every year, no title and no playoffs. Like I said, your program and your team are a joke.
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Post by guest on Nov 7, 2010 9:50:51 GMT -5
You can't blame a player for the bad play calling and coaching of a team. Both players are very good but Dan Skiba was a threat to score any time he touched the ball. Crestview had a better team and coaching but sticking to the subject of player and stats Dan Skiba wins this hands down.
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Post by play88 on Nov 7, 2010 10:27:19 GMT -5
should be united QB his stats are better and he took his team to the playoff!!!!!!!!!!!
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Post by 84grad31 on Nov 7, 2010 12:01:14 GMT -5
Yep - you are showing your youth, and lack of understanding of football being a team game. Skiba GOT it done on the field, and his stats speak loud and clear to that effect. You are alone if you think he didn't get it done on the field. The MR team as a whole didn't get it done the way many expected and "underachieved" due to player injuries and other reasons I have no clue about. Even so - that's no reason to call the MR football program a joke. Chill "dude".
The Administrator said he'd bring up the MVP subject again in a couple weeks. I'd like to suggest we get some good parameters for what an MVP should mean, so we can make this a better discussion. Some people think MVP applies only if your team gets deep into the playoffs (I don't agree). In light of this past weekend, that would eliminate a lot of players, wouldn't it? Here's a suggestion: How about 2 MVPs for this discussion, one from all ITCL teams that finished 5-5 or worse, and one from the teams that finished 6-4 or better. It could be broken down even more by keeping the Upper and Lower separate. My point is that without a good, clear definition of MVP everyone ends up assigning their own definition and the whole debate gets wayyyy off track.
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Post by play88 on Nov 7, 2010 13:54:49 GMT -5
One thing i won t argue with is Skiba is a play maker. But stats united qb won that.
So who wins stats or playmaker
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Post by Hello on Nov 7, 2010 16:10:07 GMT -5
Yea, 19 carries, 180 yards, 4 touchdowns, and 2 forced fumbles on your own Carter Hill wasn't getting it done. Like 84 grad said and I have been saying all along, Crestview was the better TEAM compared to the Rams. But Skiba, was the better individual player. And Play88, I agree, McLaughlins stats were rediculous but he did have his hand in nearly every play United ran. It was either him throwing it or him running it for the most part. Now you can argue that because he had his hand in nearly every play that that makes him more valuable and the MVP. However, in my opinion, like I have stated before, Skiba avg 14 carries/game. 144 for the year. He rushed for 1600+ yards on those 14 carries/game and avg over 11 yards per carry, scoring 27 touchdowns. That is one touchdown for nearly every 5 times he carried the ball. Put the ball in Skibas hands the amount of times it was in Carter Hills or Josh McLaughlins and his numbers would be unprecedented.
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Post by play88 on Nov 7, 2010 16:41:37 GMT -5
Can t say that if he had the same amount of chamces he that his numbers be unprecedented. They would probably stopped him. Hard to predict the what if........
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Post by Hello on Nov 7, 2010 18:30:43 GMT -5
It isn't like he wasn't keyed on by every team the Rams faced and it wasn't like they had a great passing attack to make the defense guess. Their passing game was below avg to other teams in the league. I think if you give him 200-250 touches like McLaughlin or Hill (both of which prolly had more than 250 touches) he easily breaks the 2000 yard mark, and starts climbing into the mid 30s for touchdowns. And believe me I agree with you that McLaughlins numbers were insane but his touches allowed him to put up those insane numbers. What makes Skibas numbers so impressive to me is the limited number of touches he had. I mean we could look at Ryan Powells numbers as well. He put up phenomenal recieving numbers for a high school player. But he doesn't seem to be getting a lot of attention in this conversation. Why? because one could say put Phillip Arsuffi or one Crestviews WR in that system, getting that number of looks and targets and they may very well put up similar numbers. Not taking anything away from what he did on the field because he played at a very high level all year long as did Mclaughlin. I am making a strong case for Skiba, but don't for a second think I am bashing or trying to take anything away from any other candidates. Like I said before, I think this year is the first year there has been 3 players that more than deserve the award.
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Post by Raiderqb on Nov 8, 2010 0:22:38 GMT -5
Skiba wins this award. He is the most solid all around player on the field. Offense, defense, special teams, he was all over the field. And for those of you who didn't hear of mr. Skiba until this year, you must not pay that much attention to ITCL football! All three of these players are special, and as much love as the quarterback position gets, I feel that skiba's over all play this season all but earns him the MVP award this season in my opinion. But you can't go wrong with any of these young men, who's work, determination, and team play put them in the position for this type of special award!
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Post by ITCL HSfan on Nov 9, 2010 6:38:40 GMT -5
All 3... Hill, Skiba and McLaughlin are deserving. But the numbers put up THIS season by McLaughlin will stand for many years. You can't consider touches or 'what if's'... Only what IS!
IMO, a no brainer! McLaughlin hands down!!!
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Post by play88 on Nov 9, 2010 10:09:55 GMT -5
Can t argue with your point. He took the team to there first ever playoff. That is a feat United has to be proud of regardless
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